BD v TF FJC's

[Mac]

besides the 1 hour, "how not to die at BD" seminar.

This to me says that most inexperienced and unskilled people are given a quick fast course on what to do to survive.

Why do people get annoyed with FJCs that are seen as "death camps" from Twin Falls, when basically Bridge Day offers the same exact thing for hundreds of people?

I have always been confused on why Bridge Day allows complete deviation from basic sensible BASE advice because the argument is normally "well its bridge day".

Well "Bridge Day" this year has had a slap in the face and proven its not just "Bridge Day", there were almost 2 fatalities there this year, and seeing that the last one was some years ago shows that something was wrong this year.

Someone VERY experienced last year took a wingsuit off BD and his horizontal movement from that jump and his deployment altitude shows that he knew what he was doing, this then made people think "I can do that" and as the 'almost death jump' showed, no you cant do that... why exactly was that allowed? What was his experience in BASE wingsuit? What was his experience with BASE wingsuit from that sort of exit altitude? If its about freedom and BASE then dont stop people doing anything...

With the fatality this year, there are many questions that people want answered... were there doubts from people involved in the training? If so, why did people not stand up / get heard? IF the "BASE Gods" involved in the training have anything decent to say then they will actually accept "personal responsibility" and stand forward and say "ok I messed up"... But I doubt that would happen ever... the thing is, the unspoken word around the world is that you really did mess up, and you wont ever accept the personal responsibility that you time and time again spout that BASE is about.... That to most of us is a real example of the people you actually are....

[base_rigger]

Some of the claims you might hear:

BD is not BASE, it's BD so BASE "common sense" does not apply.

The only rule is 50 skydives, it does not matter if your only BASE was done 40 years ago and your last skydive 25 years ago. Oh but you got to have a 42" and a 9 footer bottom pin to PC...but then they don't check if you have switched to a 38" and a 9' eye-eye.

They say no unpacked jumps but they let people like Yuri_base go off with a WS and almost kill himself (he went into the trees).

Then you got Mr. I invented WS off objects lower than 1000' and I have watched all Robi's videos so I can low pull and show how it's done. The dude is 1. lucky to be alive, 2. lucky not to be paralyzed.

You want to throw off people w/out the abilities or with handicaps off the bridge?

Fine, there are ways to do it right.

Steve Boyle with the help of Maggot and Nick in FF and others on the platform and ground had great jumps.

Brian should have been PCAed so he could have had some altitude to figure out how to operate a ram-air canopy.

I nonetheless had a ball, despite the carnage.

[truckerbase]

Bridge Day is an eerie mix of ego, commercialism, media hype, and politics, whose carnival atmosphere gives it a casual frivolity which "prettys
-up" a sport which regardless is ploddingly uniform in its dangers, risks, and stark outcomes. The fact that the event has been called the "Nylon Miracle" (fondly) for years should be a bit of a wake up call. Every year there are near deaths and accidents, not to mention actual occurences.

To be fair to whatever jack-ass decides they actually want to run such an event, the entire affair is so inertial with history and expectations and contrary opinions and agencies and agendas that it is a wonder anything constructive happens there at all. To be equally fair, an organizer who controls loosely will be criticized as sharply as one who runs things with an iron fist and a red pen. The one would be described as "allowing too much, and as responsible somehow for any negatives that occur, the other would be pronounced a Nazi Ranger lover, who kept joe blow good guy from acquiring his or her dreams, and who is anti freedom and anti base.

Deaths and Injury are inevitable consequences of Base jumping, they count as small percentages, but are integral in the long term calculations of base. Additionally, wherever you are being trained, when you make your first jump you are a complete unknown quantity, to yourself and your teacher; an instructor can never know that his or her student will do something on their first jump as all first time jumpers have. Never. Jumped. Before. As Bill Booth would say;" There is no perfect airplane, no perfect instructor, and for that matter no perfect student..." Base is dangerous, you must be prepared for the worst reality to happen today, whether youre a student, a teacher, an organizer, or an old hand in the sport. You the jumper must evaluate and adapt to whatever environment you agree to jump in, taking full responsibility for the outcome, whether it is dark, windy, low, has a poor landing area, or is observed by 120,000 people and half the nations media...

Now, dont get me wrong. Im not defending Bell in any way, I dont like the guy. In my opinion he is arrogant and is in no way a part of the base brotherhood in his actions, which rarely seem to represent base jumpers interests or characters or eccentricities. Nor do I care for the swaggering Bill Bird, a little man with a little mans chip on his shoulder, who was blatantly disrespecting base jumpers at late registration (when base jumpers show up late to get their badge because their car or plane has broken down, or who otherwise were delayed by events beyond their control) by ordering them around, yelling at them, and threatening them, and telling them before a word was uttered that anyone who didnt like being charged an extra 50.00 dollars (because their car had broken down, or their flight cancelled) or complained about it, could get out of line right then and leave. So much for common decency and respect. So much for the Base Brotherhood.

However, I think you will find that no one can manage bridge day without complaints and problems, blame and collateral damage; no one can make everyone happy or control every outcome. No manufacturer is perfect, no instructor flawless. Never will Utopia arise.

In my opinion, Bridge Day is over complex, and over hyped, and is getting more so every year. Remember, Base is about a boy and his base rig. A girl and her gravity sport. And an exit point.

Nothing else matters.

[maggotrules]

we all love pointing the finger dont we.well **** all of u then. we have all ****ed up the only reason im alive is because im invinceable other wise id be dead to its know ones falt it just happens its BASE jumping we are all gonna die

[Raymond Losli]

What Questions to be asked ? About What Training ? You have expectations ?
It's, BRIDGE DAY.
What the hell are you talking about ?
.

[d_goldsmith]

IF the "BASE Gods" involved in the training have anything decent to say then they will actually accept "personal responsibility" and stand forward and say "ok I messed up"... But I doubt that would happen ever... the thing is, the unspoken word around the world is that you really did mess up, and you wont ever accept the personal responsibility that you time and time again spout that BASE is about.... That to most of us is a real example of the people you actually are....

What the **** dude? It was Brian's decision, and you have no idea what conversations they may have had with him?

[d_goldsmith]

Brian should have been PCAed so he could have had some altitude to figure out how to operate a ram-air canopy.

Who are you to say he should have been PCAed? I think if people are going to state their opinions, they should state them as opinions.

[d_goldsmith]

Bridge Day is an eerie mix of ego, commercialism, media hype, and politics.......

I don't know about the rest of the forum members, but I don't come here to read other people's complaining about people and events. What is the point to all of that post? Do you think that bridge day should end? You didn't say that in the post anywhere!

Also, you could definitely boil that post down a bit.

[base_rigger]

Trucker,

Are you trying to win a popularity contest?

You know you might get banned from DZ!

I pretty much agree with you. However going to BD is still fun as ever. Where else do you see such a freak show? About 50% making their first jump? Brainless stunts? I think next year you should come and we make a silly jump together!

[Mac]

but I don't come here to read other people's complaining about people and events.

All I do is try and get debate going.... I do look a w4nker sometimes with the way I do it.... its the wise man admits he is fool.... Sorry I ruffle feathers, its the only way I know how to get people to put what they actually think...

[Mac]

428, I have emailed you....

[maggotrules]

the only reason to go to B-day is for the drugs and and the party we can jump any day unless your a homo and only jump on b-day

[truckerbase]

I don't know about the rest of the forum members, but I don't come here to read other people's complaining about people and events. What is the point to all of that post? Do you think that bridge day should end? You didn't say that in the post anywhere!

Also, you could definitely boil that post down a bit.

Actually, "complaining" is a way of giving feedback, of speaking your mind and casting your vote. Bell asks for feedback on Bridge Day but typically gets very defensive when people give him their opinion, particularly if he doesnt want to hear it, or doesnt agree with it, or doesnt like the person giving it. Jason is getting the opportunity to rearrange his priorities in organizing BD. In the past he has taken credit for the relatively good safety record of "his" bridge day. Now, threatened, he is distancing himself from any apparent or implied culpability or responsibility for the event when the safety record suffers a pitfall, and he is wrongly accused of being responsible.

In reality, Jason and his crew have no responsibility for safety at all; this lies in the hands of the jumper himself or herself. Its impossible to ensure safety in any case. Jason inspects rigs. But who is to say whether or not the jumper will jump that rig? Who is to say whether or not there is a pillow or a parachute inside the container? Who is to say whether or not someone even intends to deploy? Was it packed correctly, or tied in a big knot? Jason seems to be a big fan of making base digestible to the general population. Of giving it the appearance of order and predictability. He wanted the Base fatality list to go away for this reason. The list kept bringing up that icky death stuff that made selling base and getting legal objects harder. But deaths and injuries are factual components of this sport. As the movie the Princess Bride said "Princess. Life is Pain. Anyone telling you any different is selling something...".

I dont think Bridge Day should "go away". BD is just archaic. If NRGB had become legal just this year, and our modern perspective on such an occurrence came into play, BD would be a very different event. No one, and I mean no one would be jumping with skydiving gear for example. Not that this is necessarily unsafe, but it is a tradition based in a time when people only jumped skydiving rigs in Base and Base gear was still in the pioneer and R and D stage. The tradition persists. See any similarities between Royal Gorge and BD? Not really, huh? The one is modern.The other is very dated and virtually is a time capsule. Charming and nostalgic, but kind of odd. Can you imagine a FJC opening with the instructor saying "Ok, and dont forgot to bring your skydiving rig, yah, just like freepack it in there anywhichway." Other similar traditions and attitudes may persist ultimately causing BD or its organizers or the jumpers problems. I would suggest BD organizers keep a mind towards simplifying the event and representing modern base in a realistic manner. I would also suggest creating and maintaining a "passdown log" from one organizer to the next, documenting a journal of problems and solutions, basic elements which allow the event to run smoothly and how these elements are or were maintained year to year when challenges arose, and the like. Why re-invent the wheel, on tradition or the like, when you can move forward and bring BD into the modern world by learning from past mistakes?

And about the length of my post. There is the old saying, "if you dont like whats playing on the radio, there are two knobs. One changes the channel, one turns it off." Make your decision accordingly, or just skip over any lengthy post. I am wordy and annoying. But in any case, developing your focus by using your mind is a good thing; the patience developed reading through my posts is good for you, a stronger mind here will pay dividends for you elsewhere.

Youre welcome.

[truckerbase]

Trucker,

Are you trying to win a popularity contest?

You know you might get banned from DZ!

I pretty much agree with you. However going to BD is still fun as ever. Where else do you see such a freak show? About 50% making their first jump? Brainless stunts? I think next year you should come and we make a silly jump together!

Ok. Who is this INCREDIBLY handsome Truckerbase that EVERYONE is talking about???

Um. Im already banned from Dropzone. Too wordy. Too many dropped participles. Too many sentences ending in a preposition. Too many words over 3 syllables.

That Tom Aiello! What a card! What a grammaticist!!!

Yah. Lets just jump silly!!!!

[stitch]

the only reason to go to B-day is for the drugs and and the party we can jump any day unless your a homo and only jump on b-day

Best Bridge Day post. Ever.