Mandating Students wear helmet and pads?

[mknutson]

Over the last weekend, I saw 3 different FJC courses, and 2 more people taking 1st timers as well.

2 of the FJC's, and 1 individual mentor, MANDATED helmet and pads,

The other DID NOT!!!!

IMHO, no students or low-time jumper should EVER be allowed to jump without helmet and pads.... EVER!!!!

I think anyone who try's to mentor a student in such that way, should NEVER be allowed to train anyone either!!!!!!!!

I also think that jumper forget that students rely on their mentor to tell them EVERYTHING!!!!! i.e. if you do NOT tell them to wear helmet and pads, that is the same as telling them that they are NOT needed on any base jumps. Which is FUCKING stupid!!!!!

[Cloudtramp]

agreed. low timers should wear padding etc and anyone conducting a FJC should suggest this. However, by the time somebody is ready for base shouldn't they already know the importance of body armor? And should they not also have the freedom to choose one way or another? this isn't AFF at a uspa dropzone! maybe the problem is not the mentors but the lack of general parachuting experience coming into the base world. (by experience i mean seeing friends die and/or become seriously injured etc. at the dz)

just a thought...

[Flying_Mike_D]

I'm a low jump number guy and I ALWAYS wear a helmet, until this last weekend. In my mad haste to pack and leave town I forgot to grab my melon protection. I've never felt more naked on a jump (BASE or skyjumping) than I did on that 1 jump I made on Saturday. In hindsight I probably should not have jumped but I wasn't passing up the opportunity to jump with Mick, the worst part was having to explain to the future Mrs. that I forgot it at home but that I'd be fine and I'd never jump without one again.

[Mac]

I never used to wear a helmet, pads or even boots. It was a personal choice, I liked the freedom of it all. The more experience I get, the more I battle gear up and hanwag it.

[nicknitro71]

Mick,

Strong words. What is fucking stupid is jumping, period. An instructor can recommend the use of protective gear and lead by example by wearing them...yes one can refuse to give instruction if the students do not wear protective gear or give blow jobs to the instructor...nobody is going to stop them from jumping naked from their local objects.

Education over regulation my brother otherwise there is jumping out of planes if you feel the need of the big brother telling you how to live your life.

They are their lives to live and break, mind your own one in the end. Wisdom cannot be just taught.

I personally look like robocop on most jumps but that alone is not going to stop me from getting hurt or killed.

By the way, you're all gay!

[mknutson]

Mick,
An instructor can recommend the use of protective gear and lead by example by wearing them...yes one can refuse to give instruction if the students do not wear protective gear or give blow jobs to the instructor...nobody is going to stop them from jumping naked from their local objects.

1. I totally agree that an instructor should lead by example.

2. Sure jumpers are free to do what they want. If it was my student, I would tell them to piss off and find another instructor unless they wore protective gear while in my coarse. Once I am done training them, so-be-it...

but again, this is leading by example until you no longer wish to follow or listen to logical example.

NOTE: I am talking about students getting trained here. When I referred to low-time-jumpers, I mean someone that still needs mentoring.

I find it overwhelming how many jumpers I run into that would NEVER, EVER skydive without a full face helmet, but would BASE jump without any helmet at all.... I feel like i'm taking CRAZY pills!!!!!

[kiki32]

Everyone is responsible for their own safety. That being said, I wore helmet and kneepads during my fjc not only for safety but out of respect for my instructor cause I would hate to make him look bad if I got an injury that either one of those things could have prevented. I think all students should do this. If you wanna show off without your pads or helmet, do it on your own time so that when you get injured nobody can blame anyone but yourself.

[huckleberry]

Mick,

Strong words. What is fucking stupid is jumping, period. An instructor can recommend the use of protective gear and lead by example by wearing them...yes one can refuse to give instruction if the students do not wear protective gear or give blow jobs to the instructor...nobody is going to stop them from jumping naked from their local objects.

Education over regulation my brother otherwise there is jumping out of planes if you feel the need of the big brother telling you how to live your life.

They are their lives to live and break, mind your own one in the end. Wisdom cannot be just taught.

I personally look like robocop on most jumps but that alone is not going to stop me from getting hurt or killed.

By the way, you're all gay!

Except for the gay part,
Nice... post dude!

[Mac]

In the end, if someone gets injured from lack of helmet or pads, something as simple as falling over on landing onto a rock and shattering a knee cap.. well they are the ones alone and laid up dealing with it. As long as they dont bitch about it and suck it up, then good. I agree mentors should try and instil the advantages of armour, as they should be teaching "everything".... as far as I know, most BASErs agree armour, boots, pads are a good thing. Afterward when a big boy out doing your thing, its personal choice..... just live with your choices, thats what its all about.

[mknutson]

.... as far as I know, most BASErs agree armour, boots, pads are a good thing. Afterward when a big boy out doing your thing, its personal choice..... just live with your choices, thats what its all about.

That is my real point!!!!! I am talking about jumper that are NOT real BASErs yet. They are trusting the mentor to tell them everything they need to know to get to where the BASEr mentor is. Verse learning the hard way.

Then after the initial training, if they still want to jump without protective gear, and chance a shattered knee cap. Then so-be-it....

[adrianh]

In my opinion, if your not wearing protection.... you really don't understand what risks are involved with base jumping. You have never witnessed anybody die or get seriously fucked up. When you see a true friend go-in or just totally wreck themselves, then you have a true understanding. I didn't see any of that until i had at least 700 skydives.
the only reason i got into base, was due to my twin brother... The fucker bought a base rig at around 100 jumps and had a fbc set up in idaho. Having around 3500 jumps myself, i knew i had to beat him to it , then pursuaded him away from the sport. So, i took his brand new rig and off i went.That's when i lost the passion to skydive, and he learned basejumping requires risks.
The most important gear i wear is my spine protector.I've never jumped without it, exept my 1st jump course. If i paralyze myself... i know that i took all precautions avoiding it, and there is nothing that could have prevented it besides not jumping.
i do always wear a helmet, but i think retardation would beat paralyzation.

[Cloudtramp]

if your not wearing protection.... you really don't understand what risks are involved with base jumping.

That's what I'm saying. I think that this is the core problem. Is 100 skydives really enough to understand the dangers of BASE? I think not. Maybe it's enough to develop a basic skill set but not enough to develop a healthy respect for the true dangers involved. Especially when you are talking about young males suckled from an early age on (un)healthy doses of MTV sports and YouTube. (yes, I fall into that category too)

A BASE Mentor is a very different thing than an AFF instructor. New Skydivers are oblivious and completely dependent, new BASE Jumpers should be fully aware of all the risks involved by the time they wrap their pink trembling little toes over the edge of that silent void.

just my humble opinion.

[Pikey]

"You have never witnessed anybody die or get seriously fucked up."

What a load of crap, yes i have and i still consider it a personal choice. I look at the jump then decide if i want the battle gear. My first 80 or so jumps were done in t-shirts and boots/tennis shoes.

[kiki32]

but i think retardation would beat paralyzation.

Notice how even the retards wear helmets though?

[Outrager]

I am talking about jumper that are NOT real BASErs yet. They are trusting the mentor to tell them everything they need to know to get to where the BASEr mentor is.

Such jumpers would be idiots, as trusting a single BASE mentor with EVERYTHING is a rather stupid, and a very bad idea. Somebody with a potential for longevity in this sport should gather all available information from multiple sources and make his own decisions.

Battle gear is a personal choice. However, from a society point of view, a softer jumper will cause less damage to whatever property and humans he crashes into